President Armen Sarkissian's interview to Sky News Arabia TV station: international pressure must force Turkey out of this conflict

President of Armenia Armen Sarkissian gave an interview to Sky News Arabia TV station.

Question: I will start with first question with you Mr. President. So this time it is clear that the fighting exceeded what has happened in recent years. So can you tell us the reasons and causes and what is really happening on the ground?

President: Good afternoon, Fathallah, it is nice to be at your show. Before we started I was looking your program and the footage. Let me start with a friendly gesture because whatever you were showing were screens from the Azeri side and there were no footage from the side of Nagorno-Karabakh and Armenia. But that was a small remark. You asked about the reasons, I think that is more a question to the President of Azerbaijan, because it was Azerbaijan, which started this war. And I can say that this is a war because during last 26 years when there were negotiations going on about the future of Nagorno-Karabakh between Azerbaijan and Armenia on the platform of OSCE Minsk Group chaired by three co-chairs; United States, Russia and France, there were clashes here and there once in a couple of years, but they were local but this one is major, is of a huge scale and with life losses of hundreds and thousands of people. But the reason, if you listen to Azerbaijan officially and non-officially is that they are not happy with the negotiation that is why they started believing that they can resolve the issue with force. My comment here is that I do not think that this conflict will be resolved by force anyway. I do not think that there is any way people of Nagorno Karabakh will be cleansed out and of course this conflict has become much more complex with the involvement of a third party. So I hope that the Azeri side after six-seven days of fighting understood that they have not achieved anything substantial, there is no any strategic key they have gained. But the reality is that there are hundreds and hundreds of people not only military but also civilians now in Stepanakert and other villages of Nagorno-Karabakh are shelled by the Azeri side. So, civilians are dying and they will be dying on both sides. It carries risks to become out of control. Moreover, the involvement of a third party makes this issue more complex, as before there was no any involvement of a third party; only Armenia, Nagorno Karabakh and Azerbaijan were included in the negotiation process.

Question: Mr. President, as you have mentioned about the involvement of a third party; Turkey. So what does Mr. Erdogan want by sending Syrian mercenaries to the conflict which is happening now?

President: So, again the question should not be addressed to me as the first one. Why on Earth the President of Azerbaijan or the Azerbaijani side started this war? The question should be addressed to Mr. Erdogan but I can interpret what I hear. What we officially hear on a variety of platforms is that Turkey is here to support their ethnic brothers. Well Turkic ethnic brothers go from Anatolia up to the East, Central Asia and North of China. Is Turkey going to interfere each time there is a difficulty in any of this regions or elsewhere? Each time they claim that there is PKK fighters here, is absolute nonsense. Instead, Turkey has brought to Azerbaijan not hundreds but thousands of mercenaries and these are mostly jihadists, extremists or terrorists. This has completely changed, bringing terrorists like in Syria, and this fact should make unhappy not only Armenia and Nagorno-Karabakh but also many surrounding states including Russia, Central Asian ones and so on. Third claim that they make, which again does not stand any criticism, is saying that maybe Armenians will bomb critical infrastructure which in this case is the energy one such as pipelines running from Baku through Tbilisi -Ceyhan. But my answer is that more than twenty years this pipeline has been functioning. If Armenians had been supposed to bomb it, they would have done it at the phase of construction. If they had done that then, they would not have allowed Azerbaijan to earn billions of dollars, enrich weaponry and take lives of Armenians. So, these are the official or announced intensions of Turkey of why they are there [in Azerbaijan], and none of them is realistic. What is the real reason of why Turkey is involved now is probably different.

Question: So, Mr. President how do you assess the position of the international community towards the intervention of Turkey. You are talking about thousands of mercenaries sent by Turkey to this conflict which had to fuel it. Did you make any cause like the Security Council of the UN?

President: Let me come to the international community. It is quite wide, starting from the United Nations going down to NATO as Turkey is a NATO member. And there is a simple question when Turkey was signing in to become a NATO member, were they allowed to intervene as a third party conflict in such a fearful way? Did that agreement allow to bring mercenaries to the region?

There are so many organizations starting from the European Union, the Collective Security Treaty [Organization] that Armenia is a part of that. All of these options are on table, so we are thinking of going back to a third party such as these organizations. But the point here is very simple. If this were a conflict only between Azerbaijan and Nagorno Karabakh which is supported by the volunteers from Armenia and Armenian nation for the reasons we can understand, then as usual, probably, the international media interests and the interests of specific countries especially those who are members of the [OSCE] Minsk Group would have had the power to stop this on a third day or the fifth one. But because of Turkey’s presence on the ground in Azerbaijan this process becomes much more complex. Moreover, I think that the international community should be worried as well, because there are some interpretations that Turkey is there to stay. Will the mercenaries, terrorists stay or go home is a different question. Well, I personally do not believe in that, but the important analytical thought here is that maybe Turkey is planning to stay under the sort of excuse such as protecting the pipeline, which in reality can turn into controlling the pipelines going from the Caspian to Europe. This makes everybody dependent on them in supplying oil and gas from the Caspian region, especially those who are suppliers including not only Azerbaijan and Central Asia but those who are the receivers of this energy. So maybe this is the motive of Turkey. But in order to resolve the issue, I think there is only one way to exclude Turkey from this conflict. Probably we can hope for the ceasefire and further steps.

Question: Mr. President you mentioned that this conflict will not be resolved by use of force. Do you think that active circumstances would encourage negotiations?

President: You made two points; let me explain both of them. First neither me, nor other Armenians believe that this conflict is possible to resolve by force, especially after Turkey intervened. Every Armenian worldwide and every friend of an Armenian worldwide knows that 105 years ago Turkey committed a huge crime. The name of that crime is the Armenian Genocide. As a result, one and a half million people died, and the current Armenian Diaspora from Argentina, the United States up to Asia, Russia, the Middle East is the result of that actions. We, both in Armenia, Nagorno-Karabakh and Diaspora, feel the moment when Turkey gets actively involved in Azerbaijan, that this is becoming another attempt of ethnic cleansing or another attempt of Genocide.

And there is no way that any Armenian, no matter where he or she lives will accept that. And the morally strong mountainous people living in Nagorno-Karabakh who have seen the invasions from Chinggis Khan, Lank Timur and others, living on the land for thousands of years, who are an absolute majority living in Nagorno-Karabakh will accept this. They will fight to death but they will not allow this to happen. This was the answer to your first question. And I firmly believe that there is no military solution.

Now, on the second one. Do I want or believe that there is a peaceful solution via negotiators? Absolutely yes! And there is only one solution to that; only negotiations, but the model here, the formula is simple. Turkey is under the pressure of the international community, under those who are friends of Turkey, under the pressure of common sense. The moment Turkey withdraws and the issue is between Azerbaijan, Nagorno Karabakh and Armenia, I am sure the friends of peace in the region will exercise pressure, and step by step, we will start first with the ceasefire, then moving the forces apart from each other. First stopping bombing civilian targets, and then building up eventually lost trust and then in the end with target of going back to the negotiating table, which is one of the highest platforms, -the OSCE Minsk Group co-chaired by Russia, the United State and France. Once again, there is only one solution, which is going back to the negotiating table, but first Turkey must be excluded from this picture.

Question: As you have mentioned the mediation from France , Russia and the US also there are countries which proposed mediation such as Iran and Georgia. So, how do you comment this kind of mediations and which are closer to you?

President: Well, I would say that we are thankful to all those who are concerned about what is happening in the South Caucasus. My sincere thanks to all of them. Some of them are concerned because they live nearby, some of them are concerned because they do understand that if this confrontation goes a bit higher in its intensity, it can create a huge disbalance and a problem in the whole Caucasus. And you do not want another Syria in the Caucasus, because that will be completely destructive. As anybody in the region would be involved. So thank you very much for all models of negotiations and for mediation between the sides. Obviously strong mediators could be countries that are already mediating as co-chairs of the Minsk Group, these are the United States, France and Russia. We are hoping that these mediators will raise their voice again offering mediation, but as I said I expect from the Minsk Group’s Head of the States not only calling the sides and reaching ceasefire but also giving the message to Turkey that their role here [the South Caucasus] is completely destructive. It does not help peace, it helps war and destruction, human deaths on both sides. Any of your goals, whatever you are seeking in the South Caucasus; your presence, your influence on energy is not worth thousands of young and old and childrens' lives which we are losing every day.

Question: Mr. President can you tell us please about the humanitarian situation, as there is unawareness and fear that the region will be like another Syria. We would like to show the World the fears that you have about the humanitarian catastrophe.

President: Yes, I will try to describe it to you. But my first comment was to your colleagues why don’t you also use the footage talking today about the humanitarian crisis in the Republic of Nagorno-Karabakh, when they are bombing the capital city of Stepanakert, Shushi and villages, which are destroyed. I think the humanitarian crisis is huge. A lot of wounded from this shelling, those who lost their houses are trying to find their shelter anywhere in Nagorno-Karabakh and some of them in Armenia as well. There is a growing level of a humanitarian crisis. I am sure it will be not only on Armenian’s side, eventually on the Azeri side as well. This is a very important reason that shelling and killings and the wars should be stopped. And I think these false patriotic announcements, which are presented by the Azeri side in most of the cases is just propaganda. I mean propaganda in a sense they achieved victories. There are no strategic gains by any of sides. This is the reality, there are strategic losses of human lives. Human lives are lost for nothing. And then of course the humanitarian crisis is multiplied. People are losing their lives, their children, parents. This is not the conflict on the border or on the frontline.

My message to the international community here is to speak with Turkey and those who keep supplying the Azeri side with military equipment. I do not want to name the countries, they know. By this you are becoming a part of the conflict. The less supply, and the less encouragement, the sooner Turkey be will excluded, and we will have a hope for ceasefire through the international pressure, specifically the Co-Chairs of the Minsk Group, and then there will be hope of restarting negotiations.

There is no reason that can explain why on Earth the negotiations are being replaced with war. After negotiating for more than 20 years successfully and unsuccessfully you have to stop it because this or that side is unhappy with the other side. You have to be patient to build up trust. If you are unhappy, raise your voice with the Co-Chairs and those who have influence rather than starting a war. I mean, every human life is so valuable and it is a huge tragedy for both sides. My call is to the officials in Turkey, let them think again about their involvement in Azerbaijan. My call to the international community is that Armenians are considering this current war on Nagorno-Karabakh as an ethnic cleansing and continuation of what happened 105 years ago; unfinished genocide. And I firmly believe that the only solution to this conflict is negotiations. Because Armenians in Nagorno-Karabakh that have lived here for thousands of years in their homes, in the mountains will not give up. For Azeris it is all about territory, having that territory without Armenians.

Well, you call it territorial integrity, self-determination but it is all about human values. Human lives are on stake.

Thank you, Mr. President of Republic of Armenia Armen Sarkisyan.